Calling all W/Mo players, fans, detractors, and haters; this is your thread!

[Kataliya]

Everybody likes to piss and moan about W/Mos; "They run ahead and get killed, they make Monks' lives difficult, they do this, they do that, they suck, I hate them all, blah blah blah!" To be sure, there are a LOT of players who give the W/Mo class a bad name becasue they're rude, obnoxious, inconsiderate, self-centered, and/or just plain stupid. And, fair enough, these people do deserve all the flak they get. However, there are some people who play W/Mos poorly becasue they just don't know how to play them well! Many W/Mos are newbies (we all know that the W/Mo class is attractive to the newbie becasue of it's durability, and ability to solo), so how can somebody be expected to do their job well when they're still learning?! A new player will not know what and what not to do, and when and when not to do it! And moreover, they will not know what their teammates will expect of them. Why? Because they're new! It is this fact that leads me to the reason for this thread:

Instead of just berating bad W/Mos, why not help them become good W/Mos?

This thread is an open invitation for anybody who has ever complained about W/Mos to offer their suggestions, thoughts, and ideas on how a W/Mo "should" be played: What do you expect from a W/Mo teammate? What should a W/Mo's role be? What should they do? What should they not do? Et cetera, et cetera. Feel free to discuss builds, equipment, tactics, and anything else that will help get rid of that stereotype we all hate. And while this forum is dedicated to PvE play, please feel free to discuss the above as they pertain to PvP as well! Please note, however, that this is not a thread for mean-spirited flaming, bitching, whining, and other such non-constructive material. Rants and frustrated venting is perfectly fine, but make sure ou offer constructive guidance as well. (Note: "Change your class to W/N" is NOT constructive guidance.) Likewise, please take discussion of other classes and subclasses (W/E, W/R, etc.) to another thread.

Though the topic of this thread is the W/Mo subclass, it is posted here in The Campfire becasue contribution from the rest of the classes is absolutely essential in obtaining the objective of this thread; helping the inexperienced and/or clueless wammo become a competant, contributing, and valuable member of a PvE or PvP team.

So you say you really hate wammos? Well, here's your chance to actually do something abou the problem.

-Kataliya

[Senator Tom]

the problem is that most believe a good W/Mo doesn't exist.

[Don Crossifixio]

Most groups need atleast one tank. And I want the tank to run into the mob, aggro them porperly and not need the monk to run in and screw up the mobs.

Just a small suggestion, use defensive skills/stances that need energy and go in. dont bloody wait for your adranelin to charge then use defencive spells.

I have seen wammos run in, aggro mob, die cause the monk cant run in to heal b4 all the monster are on the wammo. Or the mob turn to the monk. both are bad bad situations.
So please spend some time to think about defence skill before slappin on "mending" and running like a mad man into the mob.

[jummeth]

I think most people still try to help the new W/Mo players. However you will find that a lot of players will not listen to advice/critisism, therefore will cause a strain on the team.

The problem is partly due to the number of W/Mo but the other is the short-sightedness of the class. As a monk, caster, ranger. You tend to have a general battlefield view most fights, whereas the war will rush in and forget about the rest of the team.


A w/mo is very versatile class, you have access to many condition and hex removers. That is what is useful for a monk secondary, as a physical damage char, your energy pool and regen just not big enough.

RE: Mending, I have already answered that in the other thread, however the general jist is, 9HP regen per second is not worth the reduction in attack power and 1pip of energy regen. You only have 2!

Remember to bring shouts like "Watch Yourself" and "Shields Up".
Lastly, never EVER *EVER* heal sig when frenzy. Did I mention never do it? Bring a different stance to cancel frenzy before using heal-sig.

[FaeBaul]

Originally Posted by Senator Tom

the problem is that most believe a good W/Mo doesn't exist.

I bet I could get a few hordes to vouche for me. Hell, I'll even vouche for Freya Jadestone, Drucilla Baul (myself), and any warrior in Requiem Lords. The bad wammos that frequent GW are just the cautionary examples that help the rest of us create better builds!

[Malice Black]

Originally Posted by Don Crossifixio

Most groups need atleast one tank. And I want the tank to run into the mob, aggro them porperly and not need the monk to run in and screw up the mobs.

Just a small suggestion, use defensive skills/stances that need energy and go in. dont bloody wait for your adranelin to charge then use defencive spells.

I have seen wammos run in, aggro mob, die cause the monk cant run in to heal b4 all the monster are on the wammo. Or the mob turn to the monk. both are bad bad situations.
So please spend some time to think about defence skill before slappin on "mending" and running like a mad man into the mob.

monk is a poor 2nd prof for a tank..either w/nec or w/mes even w/ele is better

[Fluffyx]

Originally Posted by jummeth

I think most people still try to help the new W/Mo players. However you will find that a lot of players will not listen to advice/critisism, therefore will cause a strain on the team.

The problem is partly due to the number of W/Mo but the other is the short-sightedness of the class. As a monk, caster, ranger. You tend to have a general battlefield view most fights, whereas the war will rush in and forget about the rest of the team.


A w/mo is very versatile class, you have access to many condition and hex removers. That is what is useful for a monk secondary, as a physical damage char, your energy pool and regen just not big enough.


RE: Mending, I have already answered that in the other thread, however the general jist is, 9HP regen per second is not worth the reduction in attack power and 1pip of energy regen. You only have 2!

Remember to bring shouts like "Watch Yourself" and "Shields Up".
Lastly, never EVER *EVER* heal sig when frenzy. Did I mention never do it? Bring a different stance to cancel frenzy before using heal-sig.

"A w/mo is very versatile class, you have access to many condition and hex removers. That is what is useful for a monk secondary, as a physical damage char, your energy pool and regen just not big enough."

So you're saying that in other words a warriors energy pool cannot fit any secondary profession. Most monk spells are no more expensive then any other classes.

"RE: Mending, I have already answered that in the other thread, however the general jist is, 9HP regen per second is not worth the reduction in attack power and 1pip of energy regen. You only have 2!"

If you use mending right it is a great skill. You should try it and see how much 9 regen per second really helps on a warrior. It also allows you to set and forget equips that are activated by enchantments. To manage with 1 regen bar isn't really difficult warriors arent throwing out energy spells like other classes. You can always remove the enchant if you do need that extra regen.

"Remember to bring shouts like "Watch Yourself" and "Shields Up".
Lastly, never EVER *EVER* heal sig when frenzy. Did I mention never do it? Bring a different stance to cancel frenzy before using heal-sig."

Why bring Frenzy period? If you don't know how to use it properly keep it off your bar. I really do hate seeing people using frenzy pve/pvp because I know they're going to be a b*tch to heal. A great skill if your team is going to let you hold the aggro on yourself is dolyak signet, although if some of the mob pulls off people complain that you're to slow to intercept it, the truth is that if you move back to intercept it you will let everything else you were holding back into the softies. In pvp I wouldn't bring dolyak unless you were planning to fight another warrior.

[jummeth]

Originally Posted by Fluffyx

"A w/mo is very versatile class, you have access to many condition and hex removers. That is what is useful for a monk secondary, as a physical damage char, your energy pool and regen just not big enough."

So you're saying that in other words a warriors energy pool cannot fit any secondary profession. Most monk spells are no more expensive then any other classes.

What I am trying to say there is that its just more efficient to bring the condition and hex removers, since warriors main weakness is the armour ignoring condtions and hexes. And no I don't think that the war energy pool can throw 10-15 en skills around liberally.

Originally Posted by Fluffyx

"RE: Mending, I have already answered that in the other thread, however the general jist is, 9HP regen per second is not worth the reduction in attack power and 1pip of energy regen. You only have 2!"

If you use mending right it is a great skill. You should try it and see how much 9 regen per second really helps on a warrior. It also allows you to set and forget equips that are activated by enchantments. To manage with 1 regen bar isn't really difficult warriors arent throwing out energy spells like other classes. You can always remove the enchant if you do need that extra regen.

I do have it, I use it when farming sometimes. However, if there is even 1 monk in your group, this skill is a waste of space. Hex/condtion removers will help save the monk's energy much more.

[d3kst3r]

W/Mo in PvP is kind of a running joke. I'm not saying they're all noobs, just 98% of them.

[Don Zardeone]

I don't think W/Mo can be played anything but poorly unless you do pure warrior with rebirth, maybe purge conditions, smite hex, etc...

Am I allowed to post links to rivalling fora?

[Xaero Gouki Kriegor]

use watchful spirit, instead of mending, sides +2 for no skill points, but on another subject for wammo:

16 sword + 11 smite + galgrath gash + final thrust + Hundred blades or Quivering Blade {elite} + Frenzy + Strength of Honor + Vampiric Sword= Bodyguard in guildlord's den dieing within seconds

maybe yall need to start looking at some of the damage capabilities of a w/mo isntead of healing/tanking

[Xaero Gouki Kriegor]

Originally Posted by Fluffyx

"Remember to bring shouts like "Watch Yourself" and "Shields Up".
Lastly, never EVER *EVER* heal sig when frenzy. Did I mention never do it? Bring a different stance to cancel frenzy before using heal-sig."

Why bring Frenzy period? If you don't know how to use it properly keep it off your bar. I really do hate seeing people using frenzy pve/pvp because I know they're going to be a b*tch to heal. A great skill if your team is going to let you hold the aggro on yourself is dolyak signet, although if some of the mob pulls off people complain that you're to slow to intercept it, the truth is that if you move back to intercept it you will let everything else you were holding back into the softies. In pvp I wouldn't bring dolyak unless you were planning to fight another warrior.

you cancel frenzy with sprint, its next best thing to tiger's fury, except it doesnt disable the skills, cost less energy, last about 8 seconds for just 5 energy and can like i said be easily canceled out, good way to get adrenaline, and if your gonna be in a group in pve, dont even say dolyak signet, try "WATCH YOURSELF!", you spam that a few times, gives armor to the whole party, boosting those casters armor up to 80 instead of 60 and rangers up to 90 instead of 70, only 4 adrenaline to add more protection to your whole party. . . .

[Cador]

Since when did mending give 9 health regen.

[Carnie]

Originally Posted by Xaero Gouki Kriegor

use watchful spirit, instead of mending, sides +2 for no skill points, but on another subject for wammo:

maybe yall need to start looking at some of the damage capabilities of a w/mo isntead of healing/tanking

AMEN to that! Both of em. Mending is just a waste of attribut-points. If you absolutely DO need a healing maintainer, take watchful.
I could count myself to these "wammo-haters", because there are really many ppl playing the secondary class monk "wrong" (i know there is no true "right" and "wrong" in GW), wich means half of their skill bar is full of healing spells and many of them even use a healing elite. This doesnt mean take aboslutely no self healing at all, but the main job of the warrior is to tank and do dmg, healing elites are a thing for the (primary) monk.

This doesnt mean w/mo is a bad combination, i recently changed my w from w/r (tigers rocks) to wammo. y? The smiting prayers. Almost never used they have some of the best synergies with warrior primary. Judges Insight is a huge dmg boost for each warrior. Yes, it does cost 10 energy wich is too much for a warrior. But hey..thers another smiting spell called "Balthazars Spirit": to gain energy and adrenaline whenever you are hit doesnt sound bad for a tank, and hey...u got that maintainer to trigger your equipment (eg Malinons Shield). Combine this with a energy leech weapon (yeah, i know, 0 energy regen), aggro a group and start spamming cyclone axe, triple chop. Your energy and adrenaline will go skyrocketing, allowing you to keep judges insight running and constanty spam cyclone/tripple. Guess i dont have to say that this does some nice damage.

This would just be one way to make use of the monk secondary, there are a lot of others too (strenght of honor really is nice..y do i almost never see any1 use it?). For Example dont use any energy spells at all but take "Succor" and put it on the two monk for example. This will keep you better alive than mending, trust me, and the monks will love you instead of cursing you.

I hope some of the healer-wammos read this and start experimenting, and find event better builds than mine. Like said before most of em dont know better because theyre new. No Problem, every1 startet the game once. But its important to come of that "lonely-hero-that-survives-and-does-everything-on-his-own-alone" things if your plaing in teams. (Farmings a different thing of course).

So. Now ive written way enough.

[remmeh]

W/Mos with CoP are pretty good... as long as you're running constant party enchants or something.

but seriously. i went through Tyria with a W/Mo and never ever used mending. ever. Dolyak + Watch Yourself + Healsig FTW.

[dmikoda]

Well...Im a War/mo and ive died only twice(2) through the whole cantha part, but died like 400 through tyria, starting as a noob, learning when to agro/how/what skills to use.
I would say im a kick ass W/Mo now, since i know what the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO im doing!
So if anyone needs a tank for sumthing, just whisper...
Ko R E A N

And ill change ur mind about W/Mo!

[jummeth]

Originally Posted by Cador

Since when did mending give 9 health regen.

3 pips = 9 health per second.

[Zui]

Umm... One pip of health regen or degen is 2 health per second. Thus making a 3 pip mending 6 health per second, not 9.

As for the majority of whammos...

Most of them are suffering from a "lone hero" mentalitly. They think it's just them, owning everything and everyone. Their team has no contribution to this. However if they are unable to kill somthing, it's someone elses fault. If they die, it's the monks fault. Theese types of players are hopeless.

For the rest of them...

You are not a caster. You have half of the energy regen monks have. You gain 40 energy per minute with two pips of regen. If you're going to be spending vastly more than this, or are always out of energy, rethink your build.

Keep your weapon mastery as high as possible. 16 is ideal, 15 with the hex helm is also acceptable. Having 8 in a weapon mastery because you have a req 8 weapon is just stupid, you'll be doing a small amount of damage, and the damage and effects of your skills will suffer. Warriors are very good damage dealers with high weapon mastery, even in PvE. If you are only going to PvE, maybe go with an Ascalon helm.

Don't settle for sub-standard equipment just because it looks cool. Maybe if you only play PvE, and are a totaly broke PvEr would I say do this. For any purpose other than showing off having "perfect" quality gear is ideal. Vampiric and Zealous mods are exceptionaly good as a prefix mod, ebon is also good. For suffix mods, I would reccomend Fortitude or Defense. Go with those unless you're going for some other very specific purpose.

Still on the subject of gear, Knights and Ascalon armor do not stack. It says so on the description of the armor. Read it, then get somthing else. Keep the boots, as they have the lowest chance to be hit. Well actualy they all have a 12.5% chance of being hit, but the chance of the helm fluctuates with opponent elevation, and you'll be using a +1 mastery(or maybe tactics) or hex helm in this slot(maybe ascalon helm, in this case disregard this point). Gloves also have the same chance, and it doesn't fluctuate, however you may want to use stonefist/skin gauntlets, and having to buy/carry a seperate of boots for when you want do that is plain dumb. As for the rest of your armor, pick that yourself, but please don't use full knights/ascalon and insist it stacks, and is the best armor set in the game.

[Mandy Memory]

Originally Posted by jummeth

3 pips = 9 health per second.

3 pips really equals 6 health per second...unless mending is uber and gives 1.5 times as much.

But really...I play a w/mo and I use mending and HH. Its my ultimate pug character...I can heal myself even when both monks turn out to be horrible and when everyone dies...its always funny when i have to rez everyone because im the only one who survived.

(Lol...its also my nice character...My necro does not even have access to any rez)

[rii]

Originally Posted by Fluffyx

"RE: Mending, I have already answered that in the other thread, however the general jist is, 9HP regen per second is not worth the reduction in attack power and 1pip of energy regen. You only have 2!"

If you use mending right it is a great skill. You should try it and see how much 9 regen per second really helps on a warrior. It also allows you to set and forget equips that are activated by enchantments. To manage with 1 regen bar isn't really difficult warriors arent throwing out energy spells like other classes. You can always remove the enchant if you do need that extra regen.

*cough* Strength of Honor. Not
Mending.